Interview 1413 – James Corbett on 3D Chess, Plato’s Cave and Conscious Revolution

01/22/201934 Comments

James Corbett joins Nathan Riva of IN-Depth Perceptions for a philosophical conversation on the deeper level of the conspiraverse. From 3D chess and Plato’s cave to conscious revolution and the nature of reality, no stone is left unturned in this “IN-depth” conversation.

Video courtesy: IN-Depth Perceptions

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  1. manbearpig says:

    Having been eclipsed by both parents now this was the most soul-soothing, à propos and pleasurable philosophical exploration by two beautiful people that I could ever have wished for just now.

    I would just add that because the ego was built into the navigational vessel and is part of the human adventure it is probably not merely “destructive” and “petty” (as Mr Riva seems to think) but also constructive and immensely good and thus we needn’t demonize it or dualistically pit our ego against our “essence” or seek to dispense with it in any lasting way in favor of some supposedly “higher” “collective consciousness”…?

    Then again I’ve often wondered if dualistic dynamics were what create energy and thus life and consciousness that wouldn’t exist without antagonism. In that case perhaps the Ego IS there to be reviled and fought against…to keep the mental alive…? But…doesn’t seem right…

    at 28:16 all I could think of was Sam Harris and his fallacious Ted Talk “Can we build AI without losing control over it” and specifically at 4:54 when, as he’s demonstrating why scientists will necessarily succeed in building artificial intelligence, he says, pointing to his head “I mean, there’s just atoms in here” suggesting that the human mind is merely “intelligent” matter devoid of consciousness. As if he were trying to get people to say “you’re just an organic or biological robot”…

    yikes! my student’s waiting for me already …

    • manbearpig says:

      no acting…just ‘Being James Corbett’…

      That space you spoke about between stimulus and response towards the end that “fundamentally IS our Humanity”, that is “ourselves”…

      …my parents were knee-jerk atheists. And yet they had a guru. Their psychotherapist, a certain Albert Ellis. (In fact they both served as sample cases in the good doctor’s books…)

      The good doctor had an eminently simple teaching: “A B C…”

      “A” is the activating event, “B” is what you tell yourself about that event, your Belief about what happened and “C” was the output or Consequence of A and B…

      Mr Riva’s 53:10 example is a perfect illustration of that principle.

      On another note;

      The [“not this” OR “not that”] vs. the [“not this” AND “not that”] was what a longstanding Italian colleague and friend had tried to explain to me once when I wasn’t listening carefully enough…as being the fatal moment in Human destiny… When we embraced the “either/or”, he explained, we sealed our demise…back sometime before Socrates…I think…?

      So, I’d say, not Trump AND not Putin… no emotional investment in Russiagate – Both U.S. AND Russian leaders are two sides holding up the same geo-political illusion, the same tyrannical project, just like the Dems and the Repubs…

      anyhow…

      • n.riva1989 says:

        Thank you very much for the kind words! I really do appreciate it. I’m glad you brought up the point about the ego being part of this navigational vessel. It is obviously apart of the human makeup. But I should make something clear about the ego from my perspective. We cannot deny it’s destructive forces, like the many wars that have been waged in the pursuit of “more’. More territory, more money, etc.(I am the greatest emperor that has ever lived so “I” must leave “my” legacy upon the word because “I” am so great) So I’m glad you said “he seems to think”. Because pitting ourselves against our ego is the very antithesis of what it seems we probably should do. Pitting ourselves against ourselves doesn’t seem correct. What I was getting at was can we observe our ego and how it can create havoc in our life? Do we have to live solely for the “I” the “Me” ? So it is not a fight against the ego, but a mere acceptance of that it is apart of our human make up, and an awareness of when we are being led around by it. Fights create chaos, so fighting our ego is something I definitely don’t promote. It is there and as the awareness we can choose when to use it and when not to.

        On another note, maybe a bit more conspiratorial…I agree with your observation about the Sam Harris ted talk, just listing to him speak makes me feel a tad bit ill. It seems he would like to convince people to believe the perception that we are nothing more then robots, a truly vile perception. Many people take him seriously, and his “ideas” are promoted by the MSM (should give one pause for thought as to why) but his ideas on morality are truly disturbing. The “idea” we are robots opens up a pandoras box on morality, and it seems to me he is implanting extremely dangerous ideas into peoples consciousness. From that perspective why not kill ten million malfunctioning robots rights? Its for the betterment of all of us. Makes me sick.

        • manbearpig says:

          Great clarification. Thanks for your kind and thoughtful response. You’re right about observing our ego in action, developing that power, reflex of extracting ourselves from our emotions at a given moment… acquiring the reflex of inhabiting that space, our conscious humanity…

          wish I had time to elaborate more fully… already soooooooo late now…be well!

        • normic says:

          Good addition. You can’t fight ego unless you want civil war. But as we become more present, the space between stimulus and response begins to open and through that window we are able to see the machinations of our own egos in the brighter light of consciousness. Clearly then, it’s offerings may be excepted or rejected. The illusive “choice”, pardner of freewill becomes apparent.

        • inanna says:

          Perhaps another model or way of considering the ego is to allow it two parts…the healthy ego that is developed from non threatening or painless experience and engagement in the world… and the negative ego, something that is formed and born out of pain and fear from the psyche, and serves as a mechanism to protect. Both aspects of the ego forming during very early development…perhaps even in utero … and certainly from the moment of the birth experience as the neurocognitive pathways are being developed.
          However, though the original causal factors for the negative ego may decline or disperse, the continued responses and reactions exist and become part of the feedback and associative experience that further supports the existence of the negative ego.
          In summary…as a model for thought, the ego exists as both ‘positive’ and ‘negative’….both experientially developed but one is born from fear.

    • phreedomphile says:

      If I may chime in, manbearpig. I think the ego, in the biological sense, is necessary for basic survival, for evolution of life on this planet across eons of extremely brutal conditions. Yet the ego of the social animal had to reach a balance with its family, mates, the power of its own species, and finally with its own environment. The latter not a conscious concern until hominins arrived on the scene.

      So now we have a variant of homo sapiens, the ruling psychopaths, who care nothing for balance. They represent narcissism and mania taken to the ultimate conclusion. They use dualism for dominance, not for nuanced edification.

      What is consciousness? Beginning in my mid teens I have pursued the study of this concept for 30 years now looking at every angle — basic neuroscience, philosophy, the evolution of the nervous system, comparative anatomy, comparative psychology, genetics, epigenetics, fMRI reductionism, et cetera. What becomes apparent is consciousness is greater than the sum of its parts, it takes on emergent properties. It’s not unlike the analogy given in this Corbett podcast of n-dimensional lenses and no single one can be said to be the exclusive correct answer. They all are simultaneously useful as models interacting in complex ways just as an electron behaves as both a wave and particle.

      IMHO, modern science has skewed too far towards a reductionist lens, including the question of consciousness. Doing so puts us at collective risk for losing sight of the forest for the trees (a mindset that constantly plagues TPTB, imo). Reminds me of a quote by Nobel Prize winner biochemist Albert Szent-Györgyi the first to isolate vitamin C and enzymes in the very important citric acid cycle. For decades he struggled to define “life”.

      “In my search for the secret of life, I ended up with atoms and electrons, which have no life at all. Somewhere along the lines, life has run out through my fingers. So, in my old age, I am now retracing my steps.”

      • manbearpig says:

        “…What becomes apparent is consciousness is greater than the sum of its parts, it takes on emergent properties…”

        brilliant, articulate, thought-provoking, as usual phreedomphile.

        Thank-you for chiming in.

  2. cush350 says:

    Geez….I’m not used to such deep water, shades of Edie Brickell’s song What I Am,

    “Choke me in the shallow water before I get too deep
    What I am is what I am are you what you are or what?”

    And yes James, I too have had the thought that the human mind is an antennae that let’s us receive the frequencies of life. The only thing is, some of us are Morris code, some AM, some FM, some microwave and so on.

    The more this old man is enlightened the more powerless he feels against the powers that we face. I’m tied to the rail road track, but now I’m facing the on coming train.

    Great talk!

  3. bladtheimpaler says:

    This is a different topic. Riva seems to come from an eastern religious perspective. This type of thinking reminds me of a scene from the film ‘A Passage to India’ in which the guru type character played by Alec Guinness speaks the lines, “You can do what you want or do nothing. The result will be the same.” Needless to say I find such thinking very much like a drug. Certainly there is a shared consciousness but I wonder if this is the sharing of unwritten collective desires such as the necessity to adhere to the principal of ‘do no harm’ and its corollary the universal ‘right to self defense’ when attacked.If one drills down far enough into all the organized state like religions one will eventually come to these two tenants. The rest as they say is propaganda, misdirection and obfuscation meant as mind control to hide these two tenants…if you want to be with God/ universal truth OWHY then you must approach him/it/ her through these set procedures which the clergy control. I see this collective consciousness as the more likely phenomena than our brains being receiver sets of some signal that our individual brains can either interpret correctly, partially or not at all.

    The likely reason for the world being in the state it is is because human beings do not in aggregate act with wisdom from a knowledge that if we break these two tenants there are consequences. Rather like the butterfly beating its wings with the domino effect of a hurricane. It boils down to a simply mandate to commit no theft or damage of another’s possessions, being their life, body, possessions, security or free will. Summarized, do no harm by committing no theft along with the moral imperative to defend the first two with as much force as it takes to stop the action. This is the foundation of natural law which applies to all sentient beings anywhere within the universe that can determine right from wrong actions and by doing so create their own truth of that which is the world they see around them. So first the thought that is then by actions brought into the world as our collective reality. Only hard internal work brings, observing ourselves, us to being better persons in alignment with this universal law. Sovereignty within, anarchy expressed outwardly.

  4. normic says:

    Hi James Such a breath of fresh air! I thought the point among many good ones was when you pointed out that the only real choice point that allows us to be different than Skinner’s pigeons is the moment between stimulus and response. Here is the chance for a response different from the programed response. As Nathan said, “You hit and nail on the head” That is the present moment. That is the only thing which is real. All the rest is the fabrication of the mind past experience or future predictions. Stories we tell ourselves over and over again. These stories and the emotions associated with them constitutes the “I” who we believe ourselves to be. The mind does it’s best to support the “I” by filtering perceptions, thoughts, memory and even controlling our actions to be consistent with our stories. But there is a third part to this triad, the silent observer which watches all of this. It watches the “I” and it’s stories and emotions, it sees the mind and also the world through the senses of the body. It is consciousness. I see the ” revolution” as an inner disentanglement from the identification with the stories and the emotions generated by them. This makes us less vulnerable to the media and the ideologies which divide us from our fellows. The mind will no longer have to support the “I” as it will no longer have priority. It will be far less noisy so consciousness may emerge to take a greater part in the day to day living. And best of all that moment between stimulus and response will expand to be fully conscious.

    • HomeRemedySupply says:

      normic says:
      Such a breath of fresh air!
      I thought the point among many good ones was when you pointed out that the only real choice point that allows us to be different than Skinner’s pigeons is the moment between stimulus and response. Here is the chance for a response different from the programed response.
      As Nathan said, “You hit and nail on the head”….

  5. generalbottlewasher says:

    Start down the path to understanding reality: James says Chicken or the egg. I would recommend 5 books to start figuring it out. Covers what they are talking about. A piece of each book was discussed by Riva and Corbett. What are your 5 books that form your perceptions of reality.
    1.Carlos Castanada, accused of academic fraud but the metiphysical message might be valid as allogory. 3 Don Juan books. Tonal-Denal duality, real or imaginary he had much to say about reality in mind, body,spirit.
    2.Ervin Laszlo, ” The interconnected universe; conceptual foundations of transdiciplanary unified theory” . Founder of the Club of Budapest. Not what it appears. Valid attempt at the theory of everything.
    3.Rupert Shelldrake PHd. Explores different methods of proofs using animals and human experiments. Consciousness and the morphogenetic field theory.
    4.Mary Baker Eddy.” Science and Health with Keys to the Scriptures “. She was a complex historical fixture and brilliant theological academic . Just have to read it. It helps she was proficient in Aramaic,Greek and Latin. Its all in the translations.
    5.Alan Watt ” Cutting Through Volumes 1,2,3″ wwwCuttingthroughthematrix.com. Lays out reality brilliantly. Ties everything together clearly as esoteric and exoteric perception can be understood. Explains the banking system mechanisms of controlling human behavior.

    • normic says:

      May I add: A New Earth by Eckhart Tolle

    • CQ says:

      Funny, generalbottlewasher, just last week I mentioned the fourth book on your list when responding to mkey in the comments section of a NWNW show: https://www.corbettreport.com/interview-1410-new-world-next-week-with-james-evan-pilato/#comment-58521

      You’re right, gbw, the conversation between Nathan and James touched on several “big” ideas contained in that book, among them this metaphysically profound answer to the question, “What is the scientific statement of being?”:

      “Answer. — There is no life, truth, intelligence, nor substance in matter. All is infinite Mind and its infinite manifestation, for God is All-in-all. Spirit is immortal Truth; matter is mortal error. Spirit is the real and eternal; matter is the unreal and temporal. Spirit is God, and man is His image and likeness. Therefore man is not material; he is spiritual.”

      I think what’s unique–and revolutionary–about the author (who lived from 1921 to 1910) is that she PROVED the aforementioned statement to be the reality of existence by healing countless serious, even terminal cases of disease and sickness and by raising the dead in several cases.

      How many of us can say that the ideas we hold true can be put into practice to such good effect?

      • generalbottlewasher says:

        CQ. Amen. I know this site is proliferated with people who practice putting their work into good effects. I like that the most. Apathy is the disease of our time.

        • CQ says:

          You are so right, gbw. I like it the most, too! Not just talk, but action for the purpose of helping others.

          • HomeRemedySupply says:

            Repeating important words…

            CQ. Amen. I know this site is proliferated with people who practice putting their work into good effects. I like that the most. Apathy is the disease of our time.

            …and…

            You are so right, gbw. I like it the most, too! Not just talk, but action for the purpose of helping others.

            • generalbottlewasher says:

              Homey, I’ve just reintroduced my self to Mike Rupert from a talk he gave in 2004. His commentary on ” are we historians or activists?”, really hit home. CQ, Pearl and mbp were discussing something about the film “The Great Deception” . Sequel to be out soon . Sorry I missed it first time around.
              Looks as if after this much time we are becoming historians after all.

              • CQ says:

                Sorry, four days late in seeing your comment and getting back to you, gbw, but hopefully NOT a dollar (or a yen) short. Strange idiom, huh?

                It actually isn’t too late for you to watch David Hooper’s original film, “The Anatomy of a Great Deception.”

                It’s not only on his own channel https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9v2TAiyW54Q but is also mirrored–with hundreds of thousands of views–on lots of other channels.

                So have yourself a catch-up pre-sequel!

  6. Appropriate? Yea…

    Thanks Caitlin… Thanks James and Nathan.

    V

    Frog Haka
    by Caitlin Johnstone
    If you go quiet, you can hear the birds outside
    chirping and singing at the joy of existence.
    If you go even quieter, you can feel the thrum of your own cells
    chirping and singing at the joy of existence.

    If you become still, you can see thunderous beauty
    in everything that appears to you.
    If you become even more still, you can see that the beauty
    is painted upon the canvas of your true face.

    It is fine to traffic in opinion and ideology,
    just know that you do so while perched upon the nose hair
    of a giant grandmother who is older than the sun,
    and that the words you speak are woven from mysteries
    far more profound than the thoughts they express,
    and that the ears which hear them are all made of frogs
    who are calling the cosmos into existence
    with a sky-shaking, earth-thumping haka.

    Behind our disagreements and our arguments,
    our inquisitions and our holy wars,
    our town square incinerations of heretics and books,
    life leans back with an amused smirk and watches
    as our stories sputter and splatter to the floor.

    Beneath the churning babble about shoulds and shoudn’ts,
    a hand beckons from a familiar door
    to a place you forgot about
    when the grownups dimmed your eyes.

    Prior to the oil angels and the bank boys,
    the TV talking head machines and the skullface comedians,
    the flying robots which rain fire on children,
    the rolling war cannons and armageddon ships
    and the needletooth manipulators who laugh in lonely halls,
    there is a baby made of soil,
    and that soil is made out of stardust,
    and that stardust is made of the core of your heart,
    and your heart is beating
    and this whole show is dancing
    so that you can have the opportunity
    to see it all
    and to hear it all
    and to take in the beauty
    and to leap for the joy
    and to weep for the sorrow
    and to look deep within
    and to make your decision
    and take your stand,
    once and for all.

    • manbearpig says:

      Yes, appropriate

      and take you stand once and for all…hmmm…

      but I can’t help being perplexed and wonder how someone who denounces typical MSM machinations can bandy about the terms “climate denier” and “conspiracy buff” in precisely the same disparaging manner the MSM does?

      and how someone who professes to have

      “been watching climate deniers for a long time”

      can so woefully misrepresent them and their ideas in exactly the same way the MSM does, writing the following:

      “…They used to deny climate change altogether…”

      -I haven’t yet met a man-made climate change “denier” who has denied the climate is changing…

      “…then sometime around the turn of the century they started admitting that yes, we are seeing a warming trend, but that doesn’t mean it’s caused by human behavior…”

      -How can such an aware person with such an interest in the topic not know that warming trends existed before the industrial era that weren’t caused by “human behavior”?

      “…Now I’m starting to see them admitting that yes, the earth is warming, and yes, it probably is anthropogenic…”

      No actually, that’s precisely what most “skeptics” or what Johnstone calls “deniers” DON’T believe: that it’s in any signficant way anthropogenic.

      “…but that doesn’t mean it will necessarily be a bad thing. That’s the dumbest one yet, in my opinion…”

      How can someone who professes to be so aware of climate change not know that warming has positive effects and cooling incurs consequences that are every bit as disastrous (if not more) than warming??

      “…Alarming new reports like these are pouring out constantly, and, contrary to the narrative promulgated by climate change deniers, they don’t generally get that much attention in the mainstream media…”

      Climate alarmism doesn’t get much traction in the media?? 😯

      “…This essay is guaranteed to get a lot of pushback from many of the conspiracy buffs who follow me, because they, unlike the Trump administration, still subscribe to the right-wing belief that anthropogenic global warming is a hoax being used by globalist elites to seize control of the world… ”

      Conspiracy buffs… ? Because she thinks “establishment powers” are conspiring “with the corporate media” to “maintain the status quo” but she’s not a conspiracy buff??
      and I wasn’t aware that “the idea that man-made global warming is a hoax is a right-wing belief”??

      ??

      https://medium.com/@caityjohnstone/some-thoughts-on-climate-change-b312f14c43bb

      Guess it all goes back to those subjective viewpoints… and a curious way with words…

  7. scpat says:

    Greater awareness of the present moment leads to more clarity of what is really going on in this world. What is phony and what is genuine. If a greater percentage of the population achieves higher awareness, that would increase the chances of not living in a world shaped by the secret-elite psychos. But how many more people need to become conscious and aware in order to realize the flowering of a more beautiful world? Maybe not many, but no one knows.

    I really enjoyed how awareness and mindfulness were tied into this conversation. It is such an interesting and mentally stimulating topic. For anyone curious about the idea of living in the present moment, may I suggest you check out Alan Watts, a prolific philosopher who died in the early 70’s. The conversation between James and Nathan is right up Watt’s wheelhouse.

    Living in the present moment is not easy, but it is a beautiful thing.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S18KUmPjRdg&index=107&list=PLVvR7-f81RSA7109wjD2m3akxn-wXbhNX

  8. HomeRemedySupply says:

    They must breed good stock in western Canada.

    Prior to listening to “James Corbett on 3D Chess, Plato’s Cave and Conscious Revolution”, I watched some of Nathan Riva’s other videos.
    His previous video (11 minutes), “What is your why?”, set the stage.
    And I enjoyed seeing his garden while hearing his thoughts in “How to beat the New World Order? Become who you truly are”.

    Like most Corbett Members, I cherish conversations discussing deep seated beliefs and ideas, the nature of man, and fundamentals surrounding the human condition.
    Discussion of the “Awareness of Awareness Unit” and a being’s mental mechanisms help us all gain more insight and evolve.

    Great wrap-up to a wonderful conversation…
    “…We have to become authors of our reality….”
    (~102 minute mark)
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOhYn6vuDHk&feature=youtu.be&t=1h1m31s

  9. Libertydan says:

    To quote a former CIA Director, “We will know that we are successful when everything the American people believe is a lie”. Lies and deception are the ways of evil. The CIA has been under the control of Fascist Zionists since before it was created. The Fascist, Terrorist state of Israel was created by Terrorists and continues to be under the control of Terrorists who use fear as a means to control people around the world. They are the architects of the events of 9/11/01, the attack on the USS Liberty in 1967, and nearly every well planned “False Flag” event around the planet.
    Anyone that still believes that 19 Arabs armed with Box Cutters Skyjacked 4 planes on 9/11/01 because they hated America, is living a lie. They are willfully living a lie because they fear the truth or worship the Devil.
    If Jesus Christ represents the Truth and the light, and the Fascist Zionists Rothschild Banking Cartel, along with the military fascist State of Israel, are the source of Lies and Deception, then, these Fascist Zionists are “The Anti-Christ”
    If you want proof of who the architects were of the 9/11/01 events go to
    http://www.bollyn.com

  10. dub says:

    There was a time when I believed that I was an Electrical Engineer. Since then I was profoundly influenced by Echart Tolle’s book “The Power of Now”. Now I find it amusing when ever I hear someone describing themselves as a libertarian, anarchist, Democrat, Doctor, Christian, Atheist etc. The English language has evolved into such a weapon of mind control and psyops that most people are completely unaware of it. Now that I am more awake: I am never hungry; I do have hunger. I have never bought a home; I have bought a house. In addition to the subtle mind control we are constantly bombarded with completely absurd phrases : George Bush was not responsible for “disarming Saddam Hussein” ;he was responsible for killing hundreds of thousands of Iraqis. The Fed did not institute “Quantitative easing”; they counterfeited currency.

  11. stephen says:

    I tried listening to this ‘interview’ twice. I wanted to hear James talk, but this conversation seemed to be a platform for Riva to hog the microphone and expound ad infinitum about his ‘metaphysical constructs’ and repeating himself at the expense of a two-way dialogue. Maybe James was fine with this different topic discussion track, and was content with his role in the interview.
    Narcissism comes first to mind when considering Riva’s character, and also an immaturity with regards to conducting himself in a guest interview (looking at the relatively scant content on his YouTube channel, it appears Riva is pretty new to the providing content game, which is fine). Can’t say I will give that interview a third listen, nor am I inclined to want to invest any further time into any future collaborations the Corbett Report does with Riva. In any event, I would hope that IN-Depth interviewer does more listening and talks less with guests in the future.
    Perhaps it’s just a stylistic preference, too. Maybe other listeners would disagree with my experience…

  12. rueckl1b says:

    Hi James,

    wow this interview really has Skeptiko-Qualities (skeptiko.com).
    Cool stuff.
    Turns out many people now come to the conclusion that consciousness seems to be fundamental, not the material.
    Something is converging here in the alternative media scene.

    Cheers
    Bernd

  13. m.clare says:

    “I” Consists of > 1 Mind as Confirmed by Evolution, Anatomy and Experience

    The human brain is a composite structure. As such, we are in possession of more than one mind. The cerebral cortex outcropping is responsible for logic, math, language (including the language of thoughts) etc. Ancient structures, out of which this reasoning grey matter sprouted, are responsible for Non-Thinking, Non-Reasoning, Non-Linguistic awareness. As our minds have evolved, the lizards brain has remained and plays an invaluable role in perception and emotions.

    We have been discouraged to develop a sensible relationship with this separate mind that non-psychopaths are generally aware of but have been misdirected and confused. It is here that religious fairy tales, spirituality and brainwashing reside. We “feel it in our gut” means that it is experienced in the emotional mind with which we are discouraged from exploring. Rather, we are spoon fed ready supernatural answers that shape our thoughts, beliefs and ultimately our actions.

    Spirituality, belief, faith and hope are thoroughly exploitative terms. The PTSB have understood this for a very long time. Symbolic flag waving, stirring sound tracks, Invisible-Omniscient-Bearded-Sky-Wizard Bless America. Queen and Country. Don’t you DARE question 911 or Climate Crisis. The cerebral cortex need not engage because the lower brain structures have been sufficiently traumatized to guarantee knee-jerk emotional reactions. This is the objective of competent propagandists and they have been extremely successful.

    Yoga is one of many methods for learning about the anatomy of your body and mind and building a sensible relationship and awareness with ourselves and others. I reject supernatural, unknowable fairy tale explanations for MY consciousness inflicted upon me by those who wish to keep me in the dark ….the better to control me.

    • manbearpig says:

      ““I” Consists of > 1 Mind as Confirmed by Evolution, Anatomy and Experience

      …Spirituality, belief, faith and hope are thoroughly exploitative terms…”

      Yes. They are.

      but…

      Would you say you’re a proponent of existentialist materialism??

      A sort of doubting Thomas? Who can only believe what he can see?

      I’m no scientist but as I recall, during Galileo’s time, there were natural phenomena such as germs and microwaves that the physicist had no means of decisively detecting

      that we can substantiate now today,

      that might have impacted his vision of the universe.

      Don’t you think there might be such phenomena, waves and/or particles or something completely other, presently unimaginable,

      that might impact your own?

      Existentialist materialism means we’re inherently no better than those horrifying fictional zombies devouring popular culture these days, doesn’t it?

      Yet the Universe has created consciousness.

      • generalbottlewasher says:

        MBP- flowing river of waxing elocutionism, it does!, in answer reverse, for I have no will to resist the currents of correction… except to say, Yet the consciousness has created the universe!
        Much ado.

        • manbearpig says:

          waning elocutionism and the chicken or the egg… if the subject is inherently inconsequential, our perception of it isn’t.

          • manbearpig says:

            come to think of it… it’s the chicken And the egg…

            • generalbottlewasher says:

              This is where we hand it over to Catlain Johnstone to blather on and on about the chicken telling every touch word known about the egg then claiming how idiotic it is that it can’t be anything than an oligarchy plot to deny the chickens right to be first. Oh yeah a human cause to chicken denial. Only the unborn egg is showing any promise for a brighter future.

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